Despite being an easy target for unjust treatment by critics – and I say this as someone who doesn’t think Benedict is going nearly as far as he must to deal with the "bishop problem" – there is a sense in which people who want to see actual repentance and reform in the Church over the child sex abuse scandal, instead of show trials and theater....
And here's Father Z's response:
Ummmm.... what would that look like, exactly? What would "actual repentance" look and sound like? Would there not be a greater risk of "show trials" and "theater" if dramatic gestures were made rather than steady quiet reform and change?
I've been reluctant to state this a lot because the learned knee-jerk reply is "Don't you care about the molested children?" And that goes to my theory why not many Catholic commentators want to deal with the silliness and fruitlessness of the demand for a sustained, dramatic self-immolation in front of television cameras on the part of Catholic Church leaders. Everyone should at least acknowledge the fact that this action would do nothing to protect children. And if they think it would, they need to explain how since no one ever has.
Their real problem is this: how do you film "steady quiet reform and change"? And who buys ads to run during the breaks? Those are media questions and problems, and in my view don't go anywhere near the real problem of the sexual abuse of minors, the causes, or the remedies.
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Thank you for this, Pauli. Recently I counseled Jonathan to just ignore Dreher, but now the anti-Catholic bigot has gone too far, once again. I look forward to commenting today, at various intervals between assignments, on the Rod-Man's latest jerkiness. Can't wait for Kathleen to weigh in -- tee-hee!! :)
ReplyDeleteDiane, I should have acknowledged that you sent me the link, so I do so now--thanks.
ReplyDeleteTo me, it's vindication to have this incessant call for more drama pointed out by Father Z among his other excellent observations.
Thanks, Pauli--no problema!!!
ReplyDeleteFor me, as always, it's Dreher's hypocrisy and double standards that get my goat.
Recently I learned that Dreher's beloved Gandalfian archbishop once received into the OCA a rogue, vagante monastery rife with ephebophilia -- the "abbot" and his right-hand guy would import young Ukrainian novices so they could have an on-site harem to molest at will. (I am not making this up.) At the time that Abp Gandalf received this monastery, it was under police investigation because (get this!) one of the young Ukrainian kids, after years of sexual abuse, had stabbed a young nun (the monastery bookkeeper) 97 times.
97 times.
The case was so notorious that it inspired a book, Murder at Holy Cross.
The murder case was in full swing when Abp Gandalf took the perps into his fold. This same sick, twisted monastery is *still* part of the OCA, in good standing, to this day!!
If anything like this had ever happened in the Catholic Church, Dreher would never, ever, ever let us forget it. He'd be calling for "repentance" till his eyes bubbled.
A fair-minded Orthodox told me recently that we RCs are light years ahead of the Orthodox in our clean-up efforts; that there is a pervasive culture of homosexuality and ephebophilia within clerical Orthodoxy; that many people know about the rot and filth, but the leadership refuses to do anything about it "lest the Church be destroyed" (sound familiar??); etc. etc. You can bet your bippy that Rod knows about all this -- which makes his relentless attacks upon US only that much more hypocritical and despicable.
I have a different angle from Diane's.
ReplyDeletePauli's characterization of Dreher's post as a "drum solo" is oh-so-perfect. Like a drum solo, it is too long (with 2 encores and counting), and nobody in the audience really gets the point of it. Ultimately, it is narcissistic.
The part that got me was that beginning with: "A personal story: In the summer of 2002, reeling from the psychological shock and trauma of 9/11, and the child sex abuse scandal, which began breaking in January of that year, with the Geoghan trial in Boston, I was having enormous trouble sleeping because of residual anger and anxiety . . . .
What exactly is the point of sharing that with us? Other than, of course, the usual Dreher approach of building street cred, just like the I'm-a-conservative-Orthodox-Christianist-but-[conservative trashing goes here] schtick. This time, it is really sick, tho -- we're supposed to feel sorry for him and excuse his ranting because, you know, nobody suffered vicariously from 9/11 and pedophilia more than did Our Hero. So pay attention to what I say, World!
I'll offer some gratuitous therapy: Rod, you suffer from journalist syndrome. You want to change the world, but you are a journalist and thus by definition you are doing nothing about it. Other than, of course, ragging others to do something and then ragging them again when they don't do it to your liking. Actually, you have a more serious case of journalist syndrome, in that it seems you actively run from any possibility of actually doing anything* or being involved in an organization that can be of consequence or responsibility (tiny church, some think tank talking with Dame Beer or whomever). No wonder you're angry. So my therapy for you is this: Do something! You're a smart guy, and you mean well -- you can do it.
Meanwhile, please stop what you're now doing.
* Other than buying a pint of local raspberries, that is.
This time, it is really sick, tho -- we're supposed to feel sorry for him and excuse his ranting because, you know, nobody suffered vicariously from 9/11 and pedophilia more than did Our Hero. So pay attention to what I say, World!
ReplyDeleteLOL, yes, there is that, too.
"Narcissistic" nails it.
Must-read: http://ow.ly/1uS1c
ReplyDeletePikkumatti writes--
ReplyDeleteThe part that got me was that beginning with: "A personal story: In the summer of 2002, reeling from the psychological shock and trauma of 9/11, and the child sex abuse scandal, which began breaking in January of that year, with the Geoghan trial in Boston, I was having enormous trouble sleeping because of residual anger and anxiety . . . .
What exactly is the point of sharing that with us?
Here's his point as I see it. Any Catholic -- priest or lay -- who got a single good night's sleep during this time just *didn't care* about the scandal. They might have been angry, but not nearly enough.
I've always figured we weren't supposed to have what he calls "residual anger". According to scripture, anger isn't suppoed to reside with you, i.e., you shouldn't "let the sun go down on your anger". God's anger is described as momentary and passing.
Insofar as the sex scandal is concerned, I still feel like there is a sort of "anger meter" being hooked up to church leaders and its readings are more important to those like Dreher than any progress made or policy changes.
What does actual repentance look and sound like when we ourselves actually repent of our own personal sins?
ReplyDeleteDo American Catholics -- to say nothing of American journalists -- have enough experience with repentance to answer?
Tom, I'm not sure what your point is, but my act of repenting from my personal sins and amending my life is as far as I know completely invisible and soundless to all outside observers, including intrepid journalists.
ReplyDeleteMaybe next Saturday after I make a good confession I'll ask Father and he'll step out into the church for a moment and announce "PAULI HAS REPENTED OF HIS SINS!!" and everybody can clap and cheer. Then I'll come out redfaced and crying and rend my LeBron James t-shirt as my penance. A cameraman from an earlier wedding will record the incident and submit it to to local TV stations. Then we can watch it all on the 6-o'clock news and we'll know INFALLIBLY what repentance should look and sound like for "Joe-six-pack".
Pauli, LOL!
ReplyDeleteOr maybe you could pull a Jimmy Swaggart and weep crocodile tears before your congregation (conveniently telecast on national TV).
Pauli:
ReplyDeleteMy point is that "people who want to see actual repentance" may not have given much thought to what seeing actual repentance is like. Especially if their experience of repentance is largely a matter of watching other people express repentance in public.
OK, Tom. I totally agree with that now that you clarified it.
ReplyDeleteJust to clarify my position a little bit, I have no problem with the idea that there should be some type of meaningful "public repentance" expressed. I just don't think it should have to conform to the sort of mawkish display Diane recalls by her mention of Swaggart. That would be completely meaningless.
Don't forget -- we're talking about Rod Dreher's call for "actual repentance". We know from experience in trying to discern Crunchy from not-Crunchy that such standards are merely his subjective taste.
ReplyDeleteThe real problem comes from the motivation of those in the press who are peddling the Benedict hit pieces in the first place -- IMO, their intent is to destroy the Church as a credible institution. To them, there is no "actual repentance" short of handing over all Church property to plaintiffs' lawyers -- if even then, as we'd see probably see "Where are they now?" stories continuing anyway.
So one has to image a level of "actual repentance" that satisfies Rod Dreher in the face of continuing media attention to the topic. Given his tendency to "residual anger", I'm having trouble coming up with what that might be.
The real problem comes from the motivation of those in the press who are peddling the Benedict hit pieces in the first place -- IMO, their intent is to destroy the Church as a credible institution.
ReplyDeleteVery well put. And the attempt is thinly-veiled. But Rod either doesn't see through the veil or he's pretending he can't.
Personally, I think that he really can't see through it. He seems to believe that all reporting on Catholic sex abuse is righteous in its intent. I know that's crazy, esp. since, pace Diane's point, he won't report on the Orthodox stuff nor any other sex abuse stuff (e.g., New York Public Schools.) But this is the guy who simultaneously preaches buying local foods as a virtue and revels in his cheap imported vin. To Pik's point, this relegates his pronouncements to the realm of subjective taste and undermines his buy-local fervor from a logical standpoint.
However, I think that when this is pointed out to him he really doesn't see it. Logic is foreign to him; it's oh, so western, and he has abandoned western thought for a purer form of Christianity. That makes his position working for some kind of science foundation all the more hilarious to me.
does anyone read him anymore? the guy gets like 5 comments per post now
ReplyDeleteTo them, there is no "actual repentance" short of handing over all Church property to plaintiffs' lawyers -- if even then, as we'd see probably see "Where are they now?" stories continuing anyway.
ReplyDeleteYESSSSS! They could extract pounds of flesh till there's no flesh left, and it still would not satisfy them. Nothing is enough. NOTHING. It is insane.
Kathleen--excellent point. Even the post in question got what? 60 responses? Father Z's posts outdo that with one hands behind their backs.
ReplyDeleteIt's almost too bad Father Z fisked the Dreher post. It gave the little twerp too much attention.
I guess we just have to wait until his next bestseller is released. That event will most definitely rekindle widespread interest into his blinding insights.
ReplyDeleteDreher shouldn't have run us off. At least we'd add to his comment count.
ReplyDeleteLOL!!
ReplyDeleteOf course, he'd just delete everything we'd post, anyway. Talk about an echo chamber!
Oh BTW--y'all know how I feel about Mark Shea and his persistent blind spot re Dreher, but I hafta admit, when Mark is on, he's ON:
ReplyDelete"To quote Robert Bolt’s St. Thomas More, “This is not Reformation. This is war on the Church.” And it is using abused children as human shields. These people have not the slightest interest in knowing or caring what they are talking about. Point out that a slanderous misrepresentation of Pope Benedict has not a dram of truth to it, and the reply is: “So, once again, you fail to see the real issue here, and are more concerned about the problems of the Church and its survival, than of ridding the organization of pederasts and their enablers.” Because, of course, the only way to Save The Children is to lie about the Pope."
EGGzackly!!!!
Yes, it is 4 a.m., and I am up waaay too late. :) But, as long as I'm up, I simply must post this link to a recent Mark Shea post:
ReplyDeletehttp://markshea.blogspot.com/2010/04/peggy-noonan-voice-of-conscience.html
Scroll down to the UPDATE section.
Hell must be freezing over. All I can say is -- I'm speechless!!!
I was about to bring Ms. Noonan to this conversation myself, after reading her drivel in the WSJ yesterday. She and Dreher are indeed in the same camp of media get-alongs (Alleged conservative? Check. Bash Bush? Check. Bash Benedict? Check.), with the exception that Peggy Noonan is a terrific writer.
ReplyDeleteUnfortunately, when she is not writing for someone with great ideas (i.e., Reagan) and has to work from her own ideas, she's got nothing.
I'm sure she gets invited to all the Cool Kid parties, tho, especially after writing a Catholic bash piece like yesterday's. Rod is angling to get an invite, too.
Noonan is Catholic, isn't she? Or am I confusing her with someone else?
ReplyDeleteYep, I believe Noonan is Catholic. And I agree 100% with Pikka's analysis.
ReplyDeleteBut hey guys -- isn't it cool that Mark Shea has finally given Rod the dressing down he so richly deserves? It's as if Mark's blinders have finally fallen off. The two are personal friends in Real Life, so I can definitely understand why Mark would tread lightly...but it seems Rod has finally jumped the shark so badly that even Mark can no longer overlook it. Kudos to Mark. That's all I can say. (Even if he did kinda-sorta plagiarize me -- plagiarize away, I say! Anonymous copywriter hackettes have had most of their authorial pride beaten out of them, anyway, so what's it matter? LOL!)
New post.
ReplyDelete