Obama's Disgraceful Attacks on Doctors and Policemen
From Kristol's piece:
First, Obama offered this example of how doctors make decisions under the current system instead of doing what’s in their patients’ best interests:Right now, doctors a lot of times are forced to make decisions based on the fee payment schedule that's out there. So if they're looking and you come in and you've got a bad sore throat or your child has a bad sore throat or has repeated sore throats, the doctor may look at the reimbursement system and say to himself, "You know what? I make a lot more money if I take this kid's tonsils out."
Does Obama really think pediatricians knowingly order unnecessary tonsillectomies in order to “make a lot more money?” Isn’t this a rather casual slander of a lot of doctors? And in any case, is this what’s driving up health-care costs? It’s probably as likely health-care costs are high because hospitals have too many vice presidents for government relations making $300,000 a year. But I wouldn’t think it appropriate for the president to single them out for attack either.
No, Mr. Obama, that's what you would do if you were a doctor.
Second, Obama answered a question about his friend Henry Louis Gates’s run-in with the Cambridge cops, after acknowledging “not having been there and not seeing all the facts,” by nonetheless asserting that “the Cambridge police acted stupidly.” Does he really know enough about what happened to say that? Maybe it was Professor Gates who behaved stupidly, or at least arrogantly. He is, after all, a Harvard professor. I was once a Harvard professor, and my instinct is to side with the Cambridge cops. But if I were president of the United States, I might pause before casually accusing other Americans of acting stupidly unless I were confident I knew what I was talking about.
What an asshole we have for a President.
Doctors and cops are people, too. Subject to the same temptations you and I are, and respond to the same temptations you and I do.
ReplyDeleteI certainly hope the doctors treating me and my family are saints. But let's face, not all of them are. Acknowledging this does not make on an "asshole."
It's time for pundits like Kristol to make straightforward arguments instead of flopping on behalf of doctors and cops and soldiers. It's note working anymore.
John, are you drunk this early? Obama didn't "acknowledge" that doctors and cops "are not all saints". He accused cops of stupidity for following procedure in an investigation and accused doctors of performing unneccessary organ removal on children as a matter of course.
ReplyDeleteNumber Two Son may have allergies, and so far neither of the two docs we've taken him to has pushed for a tonsillectomy. (The second doc was an ear-nose-throat specialist, BTW.)
ReplyDeleteObama is an idiot.
well, gee, Harvard professors are people too. subject to the same temptations you and I are
ReplyDelete(yes, it's true! even the ones with tenure!)
I certainly hope harvard professors with tenure and huge book contracts are saints. But let's face it, not all of them are. Acknowledging this does not make me an asshole.
it's time for people like you to make straightforward arguments instead of flopping on behalf of harvard professors. It's not working anymore.
It's one thing for a President to verbally attack senators and reps or the opposite political party, but a beat cop? Now we find out that Officer James Crowley is an expert at racial profiling and teaches a course in that subject. Obama and his ilk want to ignite a race war in this country, but sensible people aren't biting.
ReplyDeleteGates acted like a jerk in that episode as well. Acknowledged.
ReplyDeleteBut last time I checked, acting like a jerk in your own house shouldn't get you arrested in America. Even if a cop is there.
And arresting a guy for being a jerk in his house is stupid.
Conservatives used to believe it was OK to call stupid acts stupid.
Hard for me to figure out whether Obambi was playing the race card, or playing the elite-liberal-Ivy-League card (Cambridge cop is more like Joe the Plumber than he is Whitey). Could be both, I guess.
ReplyDeleteEither way, our president is intellectually lazy -- decide via identity politics first, rather than the facts. Or he cynically figures the American public is intellectually lazy. Could be both, I guess (what is it with me and these either/or/both things?).
Obama is the very orifice itself. And a cheap demagogue.
ReplyDeleteThe cop was doing his job. Somebody had called the cops saying they thought someone was breaking into the house. All the professor had to do was show identification proving he was the one who lived there. Instead, he made a scene and did the usual "you're just pickin' on me cuz I'm black" race-baiting crap.
And Obama was absolutely slandering doctors. I have specifically asked for tests that my doctor would not give me because he said I didn't need them. In my experience, most doctors are reluctant to give you medicines that aren't available as generics unless they have no choice.
I went to a first visit to a dentist as a 28 year old married man, with (thankfully) good insurance.
ReplyDeleteHe recommended I see an oral surgeon to get my wisdom teeth (which weren't bothering me) removed, and see an orthodontist about braces. As a 28 year old man.
I did get my wisdome teeth removed, but passed on the braces after consulting with the two orthodontists he passed me on to.
Was my dentist a moustache-twirling villain? I don't think so. But I don't think my oral surgery or orthondontic consults were strictly necessary either.
Maybe this was a one-time thing. Maybe his car broke down that week, or his daughter was accepted to a college he can't afford. You don't have to be an evil person to order some things that might not be strictly necessary when the incentives are in favor of you doing so.
The current system has temptations, and some people will yield to those temptations. That is not a slam against those professions, but admitting the reality of Original Sin and evil (another thing conservatives used to be about). Evil doesn't mean pure villains; it's the tempatation of sin that haunts all of us, and why we have the sacrament of Reconciliation.
Pretending that certain professions are immune from this is just as hubristic as the notion that we can legislate it away with really awesome programs.
Conservatives used to believe it was OK to call stupid acts stupid.
ReplyDeleteOh screw you. I'm tired of whiny pseudo-cons pretending that they have some little handbook that lays out how other conservatives are supposed to think. The President of the United States called out the Cambridge police force without even knowing all the facts of the case. It was a disgraceful comment.
Gates acted like a punk, and had he just calmly showed id from the get-go, there would have been no arrest.
It's time for pseudo-cons to stop acting like petulant little ninnies whenever calls the President out on his abominable behavior.
And the rest of your comments are simply strawmen. No one is saying that doctors and cops are immune from criticism. So get off your fracking high-horse.
ReplyDeletegates wasn't arrested for being in his house. he was arrested for sassing a cop who was there to protect his property. it doesn't matter where you sass a cop, you can get arrested for it. nor does it matter what color you are.
ReplyDeleteas far as your wisdom teeth, my bet is one day they are going to fall out of your mouth, black and rotting. then you might change your mind about the "larcenous dentist"
"It's time for pundits like Kristol to make straightforward arguments."
ReplyDeleteWhat exactly is it about Kristol's argument that is not straightforward? He thinks Harvard professors are prone to acting like assholes. Sounds like an argument in favor of the cop to me. was he there? no. did he claim to be? no. were you there? no. so who the hell are you to say his argument is not "straightforward"? and exactly what would constitute a straightforward argument in this case?
I certainly don't see you making any straightforward arguments.
tired of whiny pseudo-cons pretending that they have some little handbook that lays out how other conservatives are supposed to think.
ReplyDeleteI'm not the one who is floppping to the floor at someone's actions being called "stupid."
I for one, am sick and tired of the culture of people looking to take offense at every utterance coming out of people's mouts. Yes, the left perfected this during the 90's PC era. But I will be happy to see it go, regardless of who it is, and would be happy to see some candor and honesty return to public discourse.
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What is not straightforward is Kristol's taking offense on behalf of cops rather than arguing for why his actions where not "stupid." "But he was stupid, too!" is not a defense.
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Maybe "sassing a cop" even in one's home, is enough to get one arrested, regardless. I think there are non-racist explanations for the Officer Crowley's behavior. But if that is the case, I think that's a bug, not a feature. My house is my house.
Kathleen,
ReplyDeleteYou might have more credibility if you demonstrate that you actually read the posts you are responding to.
In this case, I clearly stated that I did in fact get my wisdom teeth removed, but that didn't stop you from constructing a response based on me not having done so.
Which is exactly what seems to be going on here -- people are reacting based on whose side it would help. It would help liberals to admit that the cop may have overreacted, so we can't have that!
You know, John...my back hurts bad enough today without watching you bend over backwards to defend Obama's demagoguery.
ReplyDeleteKathleen is right -- you just don't talk back to cops. If you do, you can expect them to stick your ass in jail. And it doesn't matter *where* you're at. The professor is a professional race hustler. This was his chance to make a big scene and he took it. The cop's only mistake was not knowing that this guy is a race-baiter and that he was goading him on purpose.
I for one, am sick and tired of the culture of people looking to take offense at every utterance coming out of people's mouts. Yes, the left perfected this during the 90's PC era. But I will be happy to see it go, regardless of who it is, and would be happy to see some candor and honesty return to public discourse.
ReplyDeleteOh, yeah the President of the United States, based on a biased understanding of the event, castigates an entire police force - big Yawn there. Why should we get angry about the leader of the free world so callously disregarding the facts and all?
The President clearly took sides in this debate. He didn't mention that Gates had acted "stupidly" himself, and he neglected to mentions some of the details that would have called into question his assessment of the situation.
In the grand scheme of things this is a minor thing of course. President Obama is seeking to radically alter our country. But this statement in the press conference gives lie to the notion that he is some post-racial or post-partisan President. He is an intensely radical ideologue, and his decision to blatantly and blindly take Gates's side in the controversy speaks volumes. There's nothing "pc" about noting that.
I'll bow out, but I'll just mention that a favorite target for powers we give the government is pro-life activists.
ReplyDeletei read your post enough to know that you were bitching about being sent to an oral surgeon, essentially stating it was unnecessary, which is frackin ludicrous. quite frankly your posts aren't worth reading all that closely.
ReplyDeletein fact, i realized that i was mistaken about your wisdom teeth before i even posted the comment, but whether or not they are still in your mouth is irrelevant. what IS relevant is that you choose to argue it wasn't necessary to take them out, and that your dentist was just milking you for some sort of imaginary kickback. the stupidity of that argument is mind-blowing.
ReplyDeleteso that's why i didn't bother to correct my comment. you seem to be asking for some clarification on this point, so here it is dude. hate to be rude, but it's the truth.
"Hard for me to figure out whether Obambi was playing the race card, or playing the elite-liberal-Ivy-League card"
ReplyDeletePikku, they are one and the same. Harvard is a pit of smug mediocrity, don't be fooled.
"But if that is the case, I think that's a bug, not a feature. My house is my house."
ReplyDeleteuhhh, you'll think it's a feature when someone breaks into your house and is aggressively questioned by the cops.
Are you an adult? why does this need to be pointed out?
but I'll just mention that a favorite target for powers we give the government is pro-life activists.
ReplyDeleteOooooh, scary. You've played this card . . . so what does that even mean? That we're giving license to police officers to go hauling off pro-lifers by our criticism of the President?
Quite frankly this response is pathetic on several levels. First of all, it shows you haven't even bothered to truly try and understand the arguments being made. None of us are arguing for blind deference to the police or to governmental police powers. Second, it's a sad attempt at an argumentum in terrorem. Sorry, but it falls flat.
It's probably smart of you to bow out if that's all that you've got in your holster.
Meant to write, Police unions and members are taking Crowley's side.
ReplyDeleteHere's the deal. When the cops show up, you cooperate first.
Since we're bringing up anecdotes, I have one. Two cops busted into the office I used to rent because they thought I had broken in--similar situation, long story. I threw my hands up -- immediately they realized that I was just a poor bloke working late. I showed them ID. They apologized and I told them it was ok, they were just doing their job. I'm glad those guys were on the ball, and it wasn't even as bad a neighborhood as this Gates dude.
Next time this happens let's hope that the Cambridge Popo department dispatches a "wise Latina" instead of a hwaaaat dude.
ReplyDeleteKathleen,
ReplyDeleteYour post was an example of you simply reacting without being sure of the facts. As you continue to do, feeling free to speculate on my oral health with very scant knowledge of the subject.
Pauli,
I agree that people should treat police officers politely. I do so, and will teach my children to do so.
It's also wise not to go into certain neighborhoods at certain times at night, keep your car locked, etc. Indeed, someone who failed to do so could be said to be acting stupidly.
That doesn't mean that if he does not take these precautions and is a victim of a crime that the criminal does not bear the majority of the responsibility for what happened.
No, I'm not saying that what happened to Gates is the moral equivalent of robbery. I am saying that acting stupidly, imprudently and rudely does not justify whatever someone else does as a result.
I think you already know this.
When I get cash back from making a deposit at the bank and the teller asks me for photo ID, it does not mean that the teller thinks I'm a thief. They're just making sure the money belongs to me (and that they don't get stuck with the tab after all the hassle).
ReplyDeleteWhen a cop comes to my house because someone reported a break-in and asks me for photo ID, the cop is doing the same thing -- he/she is just making sure that I belong in that house and that my stuff isn't about to be stolen.
For someone to take offense at either of these things means that someone is looking to be insulted. And when someone is looking to be insulted, they are often obliged.
@JohnMcG: Here's a hint: Obama was not saying in the abstract that not all doctors are saints. He was using that anecdote to support Gov't takeover of decisions regarding what treatment you get. You exercised your freedom to choose to not get braces on your teeth -- Obama wants to make that choice for you, and he insulted doctors to support his position on that issue.
Why do you not understand that your "oral health" is utterly irrelevant a) to me and b) to Pauli's post?
ReplyDeleteHave you noticed that I have conceded several times that Gates acted stupidly?
ReplyDeleteSecond, this is what I mean by "striaghtforward argument." If it's goverment takeover you oppose, go ahead and oppose this. Just cut out this stupid flopping over the mere suggestion that some doctors (and others) take advantage of some loopholes in the current system, because they do.
If ObmaCare is as bad as you say it is, then it shouldn't be that difficult an argument to make.
I'll bow out,
ReplyDeleteI just love it when people say things like this and proceed to keep on commenting. Ah the internet, it's like a drug. And I'm not trying to mock John for this, I've done that a few times myself. It's kind of funny.
Anyway, back to the substance.
Have you noticed that I have conceded several times that Gates acted stupidly?
Yes, but the discussion is about the President and his inability to do the same. Obama presented a completely one-sided and distorted picture of what happened. That is the issue.
If ObmaCare is as bad as you say it is, then it shouldn't be that difficult an argument to make.
Again, I'm tired of these silly little ground rules for public debating. We can walk and chew gun at the same time. I'm sure Kristol can make and have made coherent arguments about the sheer awfulness of Obamacare. That doesn't preclude noting other issues, such as the President's distorted portrayal of the issues.
John, the five or six people who read this blog don't ever like to have their knee-jerk preconceptions challenged. (Which is a quality they appear to share with the author of this blog.) Haven't you figured that out by now?
ReplyDeleteI'd just let them be, and move on if I were you.
How dare you challenge my perceptions, Andy! I don't like that!!
ReplyDelete[secretly wishes he were like Andy and everyone else and liked to have his knee-jerk perceptions challenged....]
andy, you seem to be unduly fascinated with the "five or six people who read this blog"
ReplyDeleteoh, and the fact our points are predictable and shared by major conservative figureheads doesn't make them "knee jerk". it just makes them coherent. you should try it sometime.
ReplyDelete"The current system has temptations, and some people will yield to those temptations. That is not a slam against those professions, but admitting the reality of Original Sin and evil (another thing conservatives used to be about). Evil doesn't mean pure villains; it's the tempatation of sin that haunts all of us, and why we have the sacrament of Reconciliation."
ReplyDeletewell, no s***. are you so smug and haughty that you think we haven't considered this? Our point -- which should be a given -- is that this would also be a feature of a government bureaucracy running health care (see esp. the sins of sloth and pride)
the ridiculous thing about obama and his ilk is that they believe the temptation of sin WOULD NOT haunt a government bureaucracy.
In the meantime, try to think of better examples of medical graft than a dentist recommending removal of your wisdom teeth.
I heard this on Hugh Hewitt who is a lawyer and a law professor, and I found it addresses the utopianism re: the federal government to which Kathleen aludes. One of the ironies about having government handling your insurance--instead of one of those greedy corporations--is that you can't sue the federal gov't for denial of coverage for certain procedures the way you can private firms. The sovereign immunity of the US Gov't precludes their tort liability. There is an act called the Federal Tort Claims Act which for some limited cases waives immunity, but I don't think it would explicitly automatically cover a claimant in a tort case.
ReplyDeleteAnyway, Hewitt said that denial of coverage for a procedure is the most common tort case out there and that it keeps insurers honest esp. with older patients who won't be paying premiums much longer. Kathleen, Paul and other law types can weigh in on this subject. But it seems like a legitimate use of the court system to cut down on the sin of "ripping people off", a.k.a. greed, which will not be available as a check on the feds. So their greed will go unchecked as they deny surgeries for useless bread gobblers. Good times!
yup, it's true. you can't sue the government for wrongdoing. that's why a government bureaucrat's job is so easy -- as long as he fulfills all the stupid rules like signing in and out, or not, say, murdering his supervisor, he can get away with basically anything.
ReplyDeletelots of those bureaucrats start out zealous then end up rotting in their offices doing nothing. one government lawyer i know of was prancing around naked in his office and someone in a neighboring building called the cops on him. did he get fired? of course not.
I guess we "rich" white people will have to rely on bribery for coverage. We'll keep a secret list of the "good" folks willing to falsify documents to ensure that out families are taken care of.
ReplyDeleteI'm really scared about this whole socialized health care thing. My Mom is 77, and while she is in good health for now, I worry about the future should this takeover happen. Although my sister *supports* "universal" health care and wants it to happen, I worry about her too. She has some very serious health problems. I've tried to tell her that this is *not* the answer, but she doesn't listen.
ReplyDelete